Registering property in Egypt

[dave99]

Lack of title tracking

Because the ERC is never going to be the final purchaser they do not register the land. They of course have receipts for the purchase and they know the history of the ownership (the land was owned by the government). ERC then sell the land in plots to the Developers, who equally understand that there are unlikely to be any title issues, so again, their purchase is not registered.
The first actual registration of the finished property will by the owner of each property and the title will be freehold. I hope this explains the procedure in Sahl Hasheesh. It may not be so clear cut if land is being purchased from individuals rather than from the government.

This may explain why Resort Alliance would not provide me with evidence of land ownership, in that the have no proof via the land registry, regardless of where they say they bought the land. This is how it all starts off with the Egyptians. I suspect the land will never get registered by anyone.
Do you know if Resort Alliance are now giving copies of ANY legal sale documents to prospective, or actual purchasers for the completed development, if not it will make those apartments virtually unsaleable without the title history.

 

[Peter Mitry]

I thought that I had explained this; ERC purchased the land from the government and have receipts for their purchase. Similarly, the Developers of each plot within the Masterplan have receipts for their purchase. Every individual owner who has completed their purchase and paid all of the money can now go to the Notary in Hurghada, with the Developer, and register their purchase for around 200 GBP (2000 Egyptian). Where is the confusion?

 

[dave99]

I thought that I had explained this; ERC purchased the land from the government and have receipts for their purchase. Similarly, the Developers of each plot within the Masterplan have receipts for their purchase. Every individual owner who has completed their purchase and paid all of the money can now go to the Notary in Hurghada, with the Developer, and register their purchase for around 200 GBP (2000 Egyptian). Where is the confusion?

No confusion, it's a simple question about what is given to the buyers, and has it happened yet.

 

[tracylove]

I thought that I had explained this; ERC purchased the land from the government and have receipts for their purchase. Similarly, the Developers of each plot within the Masterplan have receipts for their purchase. Every individual owner who has completed their purchase and paid all of the money can now go to the Notary in Hurghada, with the Developer, and register their purchase for around 200 GBP (2000 Egyptian). Where is the confusion?

Hi you seem to know a lot about buying property in egypt. pehaps you can give me some advise. We are considering buying an apartment in marsa alam any advice in the first instace would be very useful. thanks

 

[propertastic]

Does anyone know what the situation is with regards to buying property via an Egyptian company?

Would this make it possible to purchase property in Sharm el-Sheikh on a freehold basis?

Would this make it possible to be able to sell within the five year time frame?

Does it make a difference if shareholders in such a company are foreigners or Egyptian citizens?

 

[The Smart Money]

Sahl Hasheesh - Your Method of Registration?

I have been reliably informed about an issue with registration of properties in Sahl, in that only option 3 below is currently available and recognised unlike Hurghada were all methods are available:

1) Green Contract - Highest legally recognised level (similar to UK's land registry) - NOT AVAILABLE IN SAHL - why not?

2) Register in Court - Medium level - NOT AVAILABLE IN SAHL - why not?

3) Signature Validity - Lowest form of protection - AVAILABLE IN SAHL

Can anybody shed any light on this issue? we all need some transparency about this I feel.

Does everybody really have 100% confidence in the legality and protection of the 3rd option?

I alongwith many on here im sure do not want to be left high and dry like those 'suppoosed owners' in Spain with their 'so' called protected property

 

[queenie40something]

Hi - I havent heard of the 1st one. Mine is different because I am buying in Sharm. You could try copy and pasting your post into the legal thread and see if Zeiad will answer when he is online. He is really busy though but that thread Im sure will send him an email to let him know there has been a post in the thread.

Maybe some others can help you as well.

Regards

Alison x

 

[The Smart Money]

Hi - I havent heard of the 1st one. Mine is different because I am buying in Sharm. You could try copy and pasting your post into the legal thread and see if Zeiad will answer when he is online. He is really busy though but that thread Im sure will send him an email to let him know there has been a post in the thread.

Maybe some others can help you as well.

Regards

Alison x

Ok thanks for your input Alison, anybody else?

 

[johnwayne]

hi - I googled ' property green contract egypt' - and low and behold a posting on this website came up. Apparently the green contract is the Sales contract - as opposed to the sales agreement - hope that help? - unlessI have misread it?

 

[distant dreamer]

Hi

It may be something to do with the development not being finished. We own in El Gouna and most of the properties are not registered and I was told this is because the entire development is not complete yet. However, some owners are currently in discussions with the developers and I believe things are starting to happen with regard to this.

Also, I think I'm right in saying, you must bear in mind that if the property is fully registered it can cause certain problems i.e. you can only own 2 properties, you can't resell for 5 years and I'm not sure if you can rent your property out. So the third option may be best for investors.

Regards

Penny

 

[NeilHollingsworth]

Hi

It may be something to do with the development not being finished. We own in El Gouna and most of the properties are not registered and I was told this is because the entire development is not complete yet. However, some owners are currently in discussions with the developers and I believe things are starting to happen with regard to this.

Also, I think I'm right in saying, you must bear in mind that if the property is fully registered it can cause certain problems i.e. you can only own 2 properties, you can't resell for 5 years and I'm not sure if you can rent your property out. So the third option may be best for investors.

Regards

Penny

I believe the new property laws are changing this and if in a tourist area the 2 and 5 rule are not applicable, however i am no lawyer. I think most people go down the 3rd route anyway and as you know the government are trying to make changes to make all this more streamlined anyway.

 

[The Smart Money]

It seems my worries were founded.

I have just been sent this by a reliable and knowledgeable figure (I'll name no names) involved with Egyptian real estate and I quote:

"From what I understand, as the plots in Sahl Hasheesh are so incredibly expensive, the company behind the overall project, ERC, have given all developers buying there very long payment terms in order to buy it - the figure of 10 years coms to mind.

As the developers will not be the outright owner of the land until well after the projects are complete, they can't pass on full ownership to buyers at this stage.

This is my guess as to why the standard registration method is not available in Sahl. But it is only a guess".

ERC is the master developer (the owner of Sahl if you wish) the land which our projects sit on is bought by individual developers.

The Implications are very important, potentially, full ownership alongwith the freehold rights of our properties will not be handed over to us 'supposed' owners on completion if monies owed to ERC are still outstanding from the developer, ERC remain the true owners of the land and allthough I do not genuinelly think this would happen ERC could legally could claim back this land from the developer if they remained unpaid - very feasible.

My intention is not sound alarmist but to forewarn those like me, who have reserved on property in Sahl, we deserve to know all the facts and potential pitfalls before we sign, you are all aware that the agent acts on behalf of the developer, the solictor acts on our behalf, with good reason we should all take the advice from those with our best interests at heart and not rely on glossy promises.

I still believe Sahl Hasheesh will be an fantastic resort and hopefully the developers will resolve this issue with the necessary additions to our contracts.


You thoughts please?!

 

[NeilHollingsworth]

Very interesting and something i need to research further. I do know there were outstanding payments on The Pyramisa Hotel of 10% to ERC however i have had confirmation this has now been paid and therefore apartments can be registered.

As there are no other completed projects in Sahl it is difficult to see if this is going to be the case as no doubt the developers will pay the land owners out of the profits from the property sales. If this is the case then i would hope the land owners are paid once the develpments are sold and owners can therefore register their properties whichever way they like.

Anyone else?

 

[wemyss1960]

This was the feedback I received from Resort Alliance in March


The current situation is like this:

The whole area of SAHL HASHEESH is under the supervision of the Egyptian Resort Company (ERC) and the Tourism Development Authority (TDA),after Sahl Hasheesh area is completed you will be able to register your property with the land registrar. At the moment Signatures of both parties to the contract of sale can be authenticated before an Egyptian court.

 

[The Smart Money]

This was the feedback I received from Resort Alliance in March


The current situation is like this:

The whole area of SAHL HASHEESH is under the supervision of the Egyptian Resort Company (ERC) and the Tourism Development Authority (TDA),after Sahl Hasheesh area is completed you will be able to register your property with the land registrar IF all monies owed to ERC by the respective developer are fully paid, whose to say the developer wont simply walk away? after all he has his money from the buyers. At the moment Signatures of both parties to the contract of sale can be authenticated before an Egyptian court.

Surely the developers should confirm and have receipt of the fact all money or '2nd charges' on the land have been paid prior to buyers signing a contract claiming to show we have freehold rights on completion - when in reality this may not be the case

 

[The Smart Money]

No confusion, it's a simple question about what is given to the buyers, and has it happened yet.

I think Dave has a point, can anybody else comment?

 

[rossantony]

registration confusion

There is so much confusion and mis-information about registration in Egypt I feel inclined to write a short reply........

I read this thread with interest. Deals between ERC and developers will always have slight variation, however only slight, as there is a modus operandi in purchasing plots on sahl. I have copies of two seperate purchase agreements between ERC and developers. In both cases all the monies have been paid in full prior to ERC giving the title to the land to the developer. Also the authority to build on the land, given by the TDA was only issued after ERC has issued a receipt of payment.

As somebody who has been involved in the purchase of a small villa plot of land on Sahl Hasheesh, I can tell you that I was never offered 10 years to pay back the money, and had to pay for everything up front!

For all large developments, and small villa lots that my company is selling I can prove full title, as full payment has been made to the ERC.

The developer will not receive the majority of his money until the owners have exchanged on their property. Exchange happens when the developer has finished the property, to the quality and finish as described in the contract, and also when both the clients lawyer, and the developers lawyer, register the property in either the local or national court.

All ways of registering property are available on Sahl Hasheesh, however one must always wait until the development that you are buying on is finished. I have clients buying on Veranda, for example, who will be registering their property fully in the highest court in Egypt. They will also be able to sell on their property before 5 years.

The Arabic laws in Egypt are very difficult to translate into English, and I am finding that UK lawyers are finding it very difficult to understand exactly what is the legal method to register property, and when title is passed onto the owner, and what is the owners legal position at any point during the buying process.

I suggest that clients interested in purchasing property within Egypt, register their property correctly. I have a lawyer that is proving extremely adept in helping my clients do this. He is reccommended by the British Embassy. He is Egyptian, and he has been working as a lawyer for over 30 years. He is used by developers, agents and clients, as he is highly skilled in the law.

kind regards

Ross

 

[queenie40something]

I have now merged these 2 threads together as they are both about the registration process.

 

[Leo en Manon]

Registration and egyptian property tax?

Hello All

I am not sure this is the correct threat to post my question in and I am not sure this question already has been answered somewhere else on the forum but.. What about egyptian property tax after registration.. Is there a difference in the way you rigister your property. I heard that the egyptian government has changes their tax laws regaring property recently or is planning to.. This could be a rumour but is their anybody wih more info on this subject?

thanks in advance

Leo

 

[rossantony]

The five year rule, simplified.

When you buy a property, a flat, villa, or a plot of land you are allowed to register two properties, with each properties total size being no more than 4000m2. The law states that you cannot sell your property within 5 years.

However you can also sell the property, flat, villa, or a plot of land before the five years, if you can get permission from the primary ministers in Egypt.

If you do not register the property, in the official registrar, you can buy as many as you like and sell at any time. You can go to the local court to confirm your contract between the first party (seller/owner) and yourself as the second party.

regards