Fuseta Ria

[phil jones]

Hi, my mortgage is with BBVA at 70% LTV. The valuer was locally sourced by the bank and seems to have done a very good job with comparibles etc. better than you get in the UK!!! Not sure what could be done about it but if all the valuatios on villas are low, there perhaps is something that can be negotiated???? Seems from this tread that the apartments have not gone down as much ??? is ths right ????

Hi everyone, I have just read e-mail from my financial consultant with my valuation for apartment which has come in 20% down on purchase price too, so apartments have also been affected, this is with Banif Bank at 80% LTV.
Looks like the whole development has therefore been down valued, therefore there must be something to be done to mitigate.
I am sure I will not be alone when I say this is a massive blow and will have to seriously consider whether I want to throw more money at a property that is worth 20% less now than when I bought it off plan 12 months ago !!!!
If anyone has any proposals as to what we can do, who we approach etc then I will be glad to hear from you

P

 

[Teflon]

Completion Date and Valuation

Hi Guys,
Am waiting on a valuation of my town house, will let you know when I get it. Anybody else had their townhouse valued?
As for completion I am being told April to be moving in, that was from the developers.
I still think as a long term investment (10 years) this development will provide a great return.

T

 

[lbro]

devaluation of properties

hi i am now really worried about the valuations and the downturn in prices. i think we all need to be directing our solicitors to make contact with the delevopers on our behalf. there must be something that can be done though what i am not sure- we are seeing our solicitor on 8th april to sign a power of attorney so will ask then- i will also speak to the bank, BBVA, about the downturn in values.
i would think that we will all struggle to find the extra finance ( especially if it is 20%) but the other option is we lose it all as i am sure none of us will be able to sell on initially.
we are going to the site on the 7th so i will speak to Paulo about completion dates ect- the longer it takes them to complete the more penalty costs they incur and whilst it certainly will not cover the defficient it may reduce it by a couple of thousand euros
i agree the properties will gain in value in the future but not much comfort at this time.
will let you know how we get on

 

[symon]

Hi everyone,

It’s interesting to see everyone’s comments and experiences! We are still yet to get valuations back on our apartment with Millennium who has assured me they are still loaning at 80%, although our patience is running thin with them! If we do not receive anything back by the end of the week we will have to seek alternative routes which it appears many of you have done already!!

It’s very concerning about the valuations that have come back already! We tried to contact our solicitor to re-negotiate the price just based on the fall of the euro against the pound over the two years; however we got no reply surprise surprise! I think as a community all buyers need to negotiate with the developer to get the reduction in price to reflect the valuation of the property!

In terms of completion dates I know we are all getting told March/April I’m not going to hold my breath as the contract states the developer has to complete within 30 month of the start on site date so really he has until July 2010. R2I obviously said when selling it to us that it’s Dec 09 and past that the developer pays penalties?

I am also interested if anybody is attempting to arrange service meter installation themselves instead of paying a fee for their solicitor to arrange and manage this on their behalf?

I am visiting end of March so ill post pictures on my return!!

Good Luck everybody!!

 

[andy cap]

Hi everyone,

It’s interesting to see everyone’s comments and experiences! We are still yet to get valuations back on our apartment with Millennium who has assured me they are still loaning at 80%, although our patience is running thin with them! If we do not receive anything back by the end of the week we will have to seek alternative routes which it appears many of you have done already!!

It’s very concerning about the valuations that have come back already! We tried to contact our solicitor to re-negotiate the price just based on the fall of the euro against the pound over the two years; however we got no reply surprise surprise! I think as a community all buyers need to negotiate with the developer to get the reduction in price to reflect the valuation of the property!

In terms of completion dates I know we are all getting told March/April I’m not going to hold my breath as the contract states the developer has to complete within 30 month of the start on site date so really he has until July 2010. R2I obviously said when selling it to us that it’s Dec 09 and past that the developer pays penalties?

I am also interested if anybody is attempting to arrange service meter installation themselves instead of paying a fee for their solicitor to arrange and manage this on their behalf?

I am visiting end of March so ill post pictures on my return!!

Good Luck everybody!!

Also waiting for overdue valuation from Millennium.
Have considered other lenders but this thread clearly suggests this is a waste of time as valuations are poor else where.
If the problem is widespread and investors are unable/unwilling to proceed (as in my opinion no one in their right mind would throw any more money at this development despite how desirable it might be in 5-10 years or so) then the developer is left with a very lovely but empty 'boutique development' and whilst he may have your 20% deposit he is still short of funds by the remaining 80% and unable to finance the development. There is strength in numbers but lets hope we dont need any kind of collective action.
I am trying to see the positives in Milleniums delayed valuation. I understand the valuations have already been carried out but the valuation is yet to be agreed and communicated to ourselves. Surely, if there was bad news they would have communicated this to us by now? Also Millenium being a Portugese bank I hope can appreciate the true value of this development and having worked closely with the developer/leisure launch on many previous developments is the best bank to be involved with currently.
Lets hope the valuations come by the end of the week.
In the meantime the lawyers are making lots of noise about completion funds by mid March which I cannot commit to before this valuation is confirmed.
Will update you as and when I receive valuation

 

[Lysos]

This is not about bank valuations, its about your personal assessment of the realities. The developer probably isn't too bothered about walking away & going bust; they tend to set up an individual company for each project. The Portuguese market, like most others is tanking. Elsewhre on here people have admitted paying in excess of €300k for a 2 bed apartment in the Eastern Algarve. Look around !. You can get a resale detached villa for that !.

 

[Teflon]

Well lets look at the valuations when they come through, just because they haven't told us doesn't mean there isn't bad news on its way.
The problem for the valuation is comparisons in the local area, there really isn't any. I guess it also depends when you bought as the prices went up as far as I could see.
I was told I would have mine two weeks a go and still waiting!!

 

[Vie 10]

Hi Everyone

It's getting very close and like everyone else my solicitors are starting to pressure for the closing costs by mid March - no chance! (anyone else using Teresa at Platforma? I have spoken with Millennium Bank today and they have confirmed that valuations have been carried out and they are expecting to receive them by the end of this week. I would be amazed given the credit crunch that the development is not down graded, but let's hope it was undervalued at the initial offplan stage.

If it doesn't value up, I doubt if we have any recourse. Has anyone approached R2i about it? Presume we wait to hear of the outcome of the valuation.

Who ever hears first please do present the news to the forum. If it's bad then we should approach R2i and LeisureLaunch to see what negotiations can be done for everyone's benefit.

I guess we sit and await the valuation.

Here's to a good valuation
Best regards to all

P

 

[symon]

Hi Everyone

It's getting very close and like everyone else my solicitors are starting to pressure for the closing costs by mid March - no chance! (anyone else using Teresa at Platforma? I have spoken with Millennium Bank today and they have confirmed that valuations have been carried out and they are expecting to receive them by the end of this week. I would be amazed given the credit crunch that the development is not down graded, but let's hope it was undervalued at the initial offplan stage.

If it doesn't value up, I doubt if we have any recourse. Has anyone approached R2i about it? Presume we wait to hear of the outcome of the valuation.

Who ever hears first please do present the news to the forum. If it's bad then we should approach R2i and LeisureLaunch to see what negotiations can be done for everyone's benefit.

I guess we sit and await the valuation.

Here's to a good valuation
Best regards to all

P

Hi,

We are in exactly the same boat as you, our mortgage application is on hold due to no valuation which millennium say they are still waiting for and its Leisure Launch’s responsibility? Leisure Launch is telling us the valuations have been carried out?? Something just does not stack up here? In the meantime we are also with Platform Legal who has told us they need completion money by 15th March 10? It sounds like the developer is holding up the information until the buyers have made more financial commitment as they know the valuations are lower than the original purchase price, or maybe this is just me being cynical?

I have not been impressed with the lack of interest from R2I, seems like they washed there hands of the scheme once they collected their agency fees. I’m not sure anything can be done with R2I now I think as contracts have been signed it has to be between all buyers their solicitors and the developer to come to an agreement on the final purchase price. We are certainly not prepared to buy a property off plan which decreases in value over the build period, if the price remains stable this I can understand under the current economic climate but not to decrease in value? If this was an investment we may as well have put our money into an ISA account??

 

[Vie 10]

Hi Symon

I hope you mean cash ISA and not a shares ISA!! or we'll definitely be down valueing!

I think we should all write to Jonty at R2i. Are R2i at the forthcoming Place in the Sun in London? I understand that other of his overseas investments have not been good. Maybe a good idea to approach them in person if they won't answer emails or telephone calls - Still I think we should wait until the valuations are confirmed - I trust it will be tomorrow or if not Monday at the latest. I doubt if there is a legal basis to reject and even if we do we then need to get the deposits back!!

Only self to blame - I never invest in offplan in the UK so why the heck do it in Portugal!!????
I will just have to make my UK investments sweat more!
Who ever hears first please update the forum.
Fingers crossed
Many thanks
P

 

[algarvefurniture]

Hi all,

please e-mail us at algarvefurniture at gmail dot com and we'll give you all the info about our company / location, etc as we cannot adv.
regards
Algarvefurniture

 

[Vie 10]

Fuseta Valuations

Hi Everyone

Has anyone heard of the status of the Valuations - promised for last friday and still no news?

Has anyone paid over their closing costs yet? or are you like me and waiting for the valuation first?

It's all gone very quiet?

Best Wishes & Fingers crossed

P

 

[phil jones]

Hi
Not heard anything yet, we have asked our bank to do a further valuation as looks like they may have made a mistake. LeisureLaunch tell me that they expect Millenium PCP valuiations any day !
I can@t see how any closing monies can be sent without the valuations, as the purchase price may well be affected and therefore the figure required to be sent as it is based on a percentage.
Has anyone had any update on build completion and then subsequently habitation licences ?
Is anyone going over in near future ?
Come on chaps let@s stick together and keep each other informed
Phil

 

[Vie 10]

Valuations

Hi Phil

I totally endorse your comments - as individual investors we can all be bullied by the developer or the banks or the local lawyers into acting or performing acts which may not be in our direct interest, eg, payment of closing costs.

If we act collectively it will make any issues more difficult for them to be swept aside glossed over or ignored by the "locals".

I hope who-ever hears first on valuations will "announce" it on this forum - Hopefully it will be good but if below the R2i purchase price then we should all expect a discount to reflect the fact that the property is overpriced.

Waiting nervously...

P

 

[symon]

Hi Phil

I totally endorse your comments - as individual investors we can all be bullied by the developer or the banks or the local lawyers into acting or performing acts which may not be in our direct interest, eg, payment of closing costs.

If we act collectively it will make any issues more difficult for them to be swept aside glossed over or ignored by the "locals".

I hope who-ever hears first on valuations will "announce" it on this forum - Hopefully it will be good but if below the R2i purchase price then we should all expect a discount to reflect the fact that the property is overpriced.

Waiting nervously...

P

Hi Phil and P,

Good to see people are keeping other informed!!

We have also not had any valuations back yet from millennium been chasing everyday for last 3 weeks? There seems to be no urgency at all, developer is saying property is due for completion end of March? Developer is saying it’s the banks responsibility to obtain valuations the bank is saying Leisure Launch have to request them and they haven’t done yet?? Things just don’t stack up?? Developer has told us that the habitation licence is all in hand but would not tell us dates of application etc as this could take 4/6 weeks and without this you can not complete anyway??

I will defiantly not be transferring any money to PL before we have received valuations and the mortgage process has developed further as its on hold at the mo!!

I am going over for a couple of days at the end of the month to try and bang heads together so ill keep you all posted!!

 

[Vie 10]

Thanks Symon

Good luck with your visit - let's trust things will improve before you venture over. Millennium assure me that a valuation result is "close" - that was on monday - although they expected figures last friday according to my contact.

P

 

[phil jones]

I spoke to my financial consultant yesterday and she told me that at my request she spoke with the developer and Millenium Bank. Both parties are telling her that they are not aware of any impending valuations by Millenium. Furthermore the Mortgae offer with the special terms which Leisure Launch offered with Millenium has 'expired' and therefore no longer available !!
Not sure what is going on, but I have writeen to Leisure Launch asking for written confirmation as to the current position.
If anyone hears anything please share with us all
P

 

[bj_bazza]

I spoke to my financial consultant yesterday and she told me that at my request she spoke with the developer and Millenium Bank. Both parties are telling her that they are not aware of any impending valuations by Millenium. Furthermore the Mortgae offer with the special terms which Leisure Launch offered with Millenium has 'expired' and therefore no longer available !!
Not sure what is going on, but I have writeen to Leisure Launch asking for written confirmation as to the current position.
If anyone hears anything please share with us all
P

Hi,
we are also with r2i, millenium and platforma legal (theresa). We have heard nothing since a week last Monday when I chased millenium and they said valuation was imminent.
Completion monies were due today but i have done nothing about it and will do nothing until everything around valuation, contract price and mortgages are confirmed and AGREED in writing.
R2I have been conspicuous by their abscence. I will contact them on Monday for advice, support and action. If anyone bought through R21 is on twitter or facebook you can make contact that way and start putting pressure on them to do something.
If we all stick together and work to an agreed plan of response once valuations are all in then there is a real chance that the developer will have to take a 'haircut'. They are a big company with lots of developments and will be working hard to complete so they can get our money and move on. The lawyers and the banks should also be keen as the Portuguese market is very quiet at the moment.
I will also be chasing millenium, PL and Paulo from LL on Monday to find out what is going on.
Lets keep each other posted.

 

[symon]

Hi,
we are also with r2i, millenium and platforma legal (theresa). We have heard nothing since a week last Monday when I chased millenium and they said valuation was imminent.
Completion monies were due today but i have done nothing about it and will do nothing until everything around valuation, contract price and mortgages are confirmed and AGREED in writing.
R2I have been conspicuous by their abscence. I will contact them on Monday for advice, support and action. If anyone bought through R21 is on twitter or facebook you can make contact that way and start putting pressure on them to do something.
If we all stick together and work to an agreed plan of response once valuations are all in then there is a real chance that the developer will have to take a 'haircut'. They are a big company with lots of developments and will be working hard to complete so they can get our money and move on. The lawyers and the banks should also be keen as the Portuguese market is very quiet at the moment.
I will also be chasing millenium, PL and Paulo from LL on Monday to find out what is going on.
Lets keep each other posted.

Hi,

We are in the same position as you! We brought through R2I, PL are solicitors and we have applied for a mortgage through millennium based on the saving on fees that Leisure Launch had agreed with them.

I am not happy with the service that any party has provided to date the communication is very poor and I feel you have to keep trying to find out things for yourself instead of being updated or informed by others that should be providing the service. If it was not for this forum there would be a lot of unknowns!

I’m sick of chasing people now so I’m sitting back relaxing Portuguese style, and paying no completion money until all the cards are on the table and I’m waiting for others to lay theirs first!!

Keep posting comments people I think we should all stick together especially if collective action is necessary closer to the date of completion.

si

 

[JKort]

Hi,
we also bought in Fuzeta from r2i. I have been repeatedly asking Millennium re the valuation and further process with the mortgage, heard last week from them they expected the valuation any day (it's been already a week ago).

Our last experience with the same developer, the same bank, different project (Pinhal village Silver coast) - the same process and the same frustration. PL had asked to transfer completion costs far before the actual completion (I think it was September, finally we completed in March!),the bank didn't know anything about the valuation, the developer told they were not done, and no response or guidance from PL. We didn't transfer the money to PL and actually quit them (why to pay money for a service with no added value?). We went with a local lawyer, who was chasing the bank and the developer to complete before the season. The lawyer even ordered the bank to make the valuation on our request. It worked out. The property was slightly below the purchase value, so we needed to pay some, instead of profiting from the property value rise. The whole process (and we had no problem with the mortgage) made us extremely nervous because of the lack of transparency, lack of accountability and the time it took. Thanks to our lawyer - she was able to shed some light as to who needed to do what and who needed to be chased.
This time with Fuzeta, our lawyer is lined up but I don't push it. I am also waiting in Portuguese style... There are two aspects important to us: to complete (and furnish) before the season and not to pay more if it turns out the house's validation will be below its purchase price.
Regards jkort