Dubai - in the eyes of the "external media"

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Saeid

New Member
I bet you will be back when the economic crisis is over and the boom time returns again!

:cool:
No, we are already investing in Malaysia, Iran and the Philippines.

As far as the boom time returning, I wouldn't hold my breath. You're looking at at least a decade before prices come to a level where they'll be comparable to last year's.
 
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paul66

New Member
My guess prices will be back to the peak levels within 3 years - you mark my word (go back to my post in 3 yrs time!). Stock markets are already recovering, and as soon as the banks start lending again, we will be back but with a much slower growth than the Dubai Property market has experienced as it will be a more mature market such as the UK.

Paul
 
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sasherwani2

New Member
No, we are already investing in Malaysia, Iran and the Philippines.

As far as the boom time returning, I wouldn't hold my breath. You're looking at at least a decade before prices come to a level where they'll be comparable to last year's.
UAE property prices will "never" reach 2008 levels in 10 years. It will take atleast 2 to 3 decades before we see those unrealistic prices again.
 
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paul66

New Member
UAE property prices will "never" reach 2008 levels in 10 years. It will take atleast 2 to 3 decades before we see those unrealistic prices again.
I'll hold you to that! My guess it will be less than 10 years before we reach 2008 prices. Mainly due to inflation pressure which will sky rocket in a few years again.

You mark my word.
Paul.
 
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georgihh

New Member
I'll hold you to that! My guess it will be less than 10 years before we reach 2008 prices. Mainly due to inflation pressure which will sky rocket in a few years again.

You mark my word.
Paul.
Ok if you are so much convinced, why don’t you buy now and double or triple your money in 3 years time.:):):)
People lost money in Dubai, all their savings – we need decades to forget about the Dubai’s scam
 
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paul66

New Member
For your info I have purchased 2 apartments in Dubai and 1 in Ajman. Myself and my colleague have just bought another distressed sale in Dubai as I am convinced that the only way is up. Of course it depends which location you have bought in, which developer you have bought off, and the price you paid. You CANNOT put all developers in the same boat as some dodgy ones!

People need to stop worrying about property prices in Dubai! It is NOT just the Dubai market that is fallen just in case every 'Dubai Basher' has purposely forgotten, the whole world is in a mess at the moment. When the recovery comes (most analysts like myself are predicting next year starting with the USA then the rest of the world) Dubai will also recover and most likely faster than the developed world.

We will be back to early 2008 levels in about 3-4 years time (MAXIMUM)

Regards,
Paul

FX and Equities Analyst
SG Securities
 
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georgihh

New Member
For your info I have purchased 2 apartments in Dubai and 1 in Ajman. Myself and my colleague have just bought another distressed sale in Dubai as I am convinced that the only way is up. Of course it depends which location you have bought in, which developer you have bought off, and the price you paid. You CANNOT put all developers in the same boat as some dodgy ones!

People need to stop worrying about property prices in Dubai! It is NOT just the Dubai market that is fallen just in case every 'Dubai Basher' has purposely forgotten, the whole world is in a mess at the moment. When the recovery comes (most analysts like myself are predicting next year starting with the USA then the rest of the world) Dubai will also recover and most likely faster than the developed world.

We will be back to early 2008 levels in about 3-4 years time (MAXIMUM)

Regards,
Paul

FX and Equities Analyst
SG Securities
Please give us some figures:
How many units are to be completed in the next 3 years and how many of them are already completed?
How many people are currently in Dubai and are they enough to handle the so called “tourism” and trade and property recovery?
What do you think is the average cost to build per sq ft in Dubai and why the selling prices are double and triple?
The property boom started in 2004 and only by 2008 we witness people jumping into the Market, Why do you think now will take only 3 years when the trust is gone?
I am on the same boat as you with 3 properties in Dubai and wish to get rid of the units in 3 years time, but is not going to happen!
It will take at least 3 years for the market to settle down the trust to start coming back and only than we can make reasonable predictions.
 
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paul66

New Member
Please give us some figures:
How many units are to be completed in the next 3 years and how many of them are already completed?
How many people are currently in Dubai and are they enough to handle the so called “tourism” and trade and property recovery?
What do you think is the average cost to build per sq ft in Dubai and why the selling prices are double and triple?
The property boom started in 2004 and only by 2008 we witness people jumping into the Market, Why do you think now will take only 3 years when the trust is gone?
I am on the same boat as you with 3 properties in Dubai and wish to get rid of the units in 3 years time, but is not going to happen!
It will take at least 3 years for the market to settle down the trust to start coming back and only than we can make reasonable predictions.
I have two properties completed including the distress sale at the Point building in Dubai Marina.
Others are off-plan but construction progressing well. All the projects were delayed of course by an average 1 - 1.5 years.

For UAE population figures, you can check out dubai.ae who has more info as well as the Tourism authority.

People will flock back to live and work in the UAE when job prospects are back - like I said before it will be later next year (after Ramadan in 2010).

The property market will be stabilised by the end of this year and start rising only gradually over the next two years, then a faster increase going forward.

If I were you I would not sell all my units... I will plan to sell just 1 perhaps others will hold on for longer term growth and plan to retire in Dubai Marina!! :five:
 
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stumbled

New Member
For your info I have purchased 2 apartments in Dubai and 1 in Ajman. Myself and my colleague have just bought another distressed sale in Dubai as I am convinced that the only way is up. Of course it depends which location you have bought in, which developer you have bought off, and the price you paid. You CANNOT put all developers in the same boat as some dodgy ones!

People need to stop worrying about property prices in Dubai! It is NOT just the Dubai market that is fallen just in case every 'Dubai Basher' has purposely forgotten, the whole world is in a mess at the moment. When the recovery comes (most analysts like myself are predicting next year starting with the USA then the rest of the world) Dubai will also recover and most likely faster than the developed world.

We will be back to early 2008 levels in about 3-4 years time (MAXIMUM)

Regards,
Paul

FX and Equities Analyst
SG Securities
All that you've quoted above is what they call ''wishful thinking''. The world is in a depresson, its just that people aren't talking about it. The advantage the west have is people have mortgages here and the banks being rescued by the govts don't wanna lose more money,hence they are keeping their housing markets from crashing, imagine interest rates from 5-6% being dropped to 0.5% in a span of 4-6 mnths.
Belive it or not, just to keep things going, nationwide the biggest building society has started the 125% mortgages again. The bottom line is people here in the west have stability and no where to go, where as people in Dubai, come there, take a risk and drop their trousers at the airport and make a runner.

I was recently offered a mortgage rate of 2.35% fixed for 2 years, can you even dream of that kind of a loan in a place like Dubai??

I am coming for a holiday in dubai next month in a 5 star hotel for 14 nights, the price I am paying from last year is a 1/3rd. Unbelivable and unheard offers.

All I am trying to stress is one cannot look at what is happening in the western housing market and hope it will improve Dubai. The govt in dubai doesn't support the outsiders, it only cares for its 200k nationals. Out here in the UK if you lose a job and you have a mortgage of £400k, the govt will pay the interest on your mortgage, just so that you, the bank and the economy remains bouyant.


Dubai is and was a bubble, recently 150k workers returned back to India and lost their construction work.
Dubai was marketed as the financial hub of the world,with the financial sector dead, all that has remained is glittering 5 star hotels, empty flats and a dead economy.
 
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paul66

New Member
Thank you Mr Doom and Gloom from the UK.

Thank god most people dont think like you do!
 
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stumbled

New Member
Thank you Mr Doom and Gloom from the UK.

Thank god most people dont think like you do!
This is the problem out here. I've mentioned the points which are relevant to the Dubai's property market, all I get on this forum is philosophy.

By talking up the economy blindly by you and me isn't going to change a thing, people invested with greed and carelessness and so they must suffer the consequences.

1)I've mentioned the 5 star hotels in dubai are offering rates which 2 star wouldn't offer 6 months ago.

2)the Dubai govt. isn't bothered who loses a shirt or his undies in this market, unlike the western gov..

3)People in the west can get mortgages at the rate less than 3%, can one ever dream of in a place like Dubai?

4) Dubai is a home away from home, people are there to take a risk and make a quick buck, hence the greed and gambling factor.

5)If one loses a job in Dubai would the gov. give you support like the benefits available in the west? the UK would even pay your interest on the mortgage worth up to 400k, so one is not a burden on the state. The Dubai gov. just asks you to pack up and leave.
6)Look at property prices, build quality,service charges, cost of living...etc..etc.
The prices of places like International city have halved in 1 year, that was the cheapest development and it's finished.
7)the biggest point I ask is WHAT WAS DUBAI ALL ABOUT??? it took the opportunity to shine when hong kong went back to china and it became a financial hub replacing it. Tourism?? it doesn't have the weather for it, everything is indoors, you cannot have 2 months of tourist season during the winter. shopping?? I live in London and come to Dubai every year and trust me things in dubai are(at least were last year) more expensive than here. So, after this collapse and bursting of the bubble what is left???

I say the properties have a long way to fall STILL, as people lose their jobs and no new employment is created. I mean can anyone out here tell me who is recruiting?? what jobs are available out there. Even people in India don't wanna come there anymore as there is more opportunity and better pay back home.


So, lets not be philosophical and be realistic. I am prepared to change my views at a drop of a hat. All I ask is some light at the end of the tunnel(GIVE ME SOMETHING POSITIVE TO CHEW ON DUBAI).
 
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paul66

New Member
Dubai occupancy levels rise in affordable districts

Dubai occupancy levels rise in affordable districts

Monday, July 13, 2009
Source: http://www.business24-7.ae/Articles/2009/7/Pages/12072009/07132009_ec849c5495ac4e00980307ebd18c9a70.aspx

More than 60,000 people have already moved into International City, while about 20,000 residents are living in Discovery Gardens, according to Nakheel.

"International City remains one of Dubai's most popular rental communities. Its affordability combined with its location makes it an attractive destination for local and international businesses, retailers, commercial establishments, traders and residents," a Nakheel spokesperson told Emirates Business.

According to the master developer, International City is made up of 387 buildings, while Discovery Gardens has 245 buildings with the majority being owned by third parties.

Real estate agents said occupancy levels in Discovery Gardens and International City is currently around 60 per cent, up 15 per cent in the past six months.

"Real estate prices and rental prices in these two areas have dropped tremendously attracting many new occupants into the development," said Mohanad Alwadiya, Director, Harbor Real Estate.

However, the profile of people residing in Discovery Gardens and International City are more of tenants than owner occupants.

"Both these developments were sold off largely to investors than end-users, hence there are more tenants living in these developments than owner occupants," he said.

Last month, real estate analysts told this newspaper that prices of apartments in master developments such as Dubai Silicon Oasis, International City and Discovery Gardens had stabilised in the past three months, making them the most affordable developments for middle-income earners.

According to agents, the current prices in International City for a studio, one- and two-bedroom apartments were in the range of Dh275,000, Dh450,000 and Dh550,000 respectively, declining five per cent since the past quarter.

Besides, agents believe Nakheel's recent move to drop service charges in Discovery Gardens will attract buyers into the development. Last month, Nakheel dropped service charges on Discovery Gardens by Dh5 per square foot in line with Dubai's Real Estate Regulatory Agency.

According to Harbor Real Estate, current rents for one-bedroom apartments in International Media Production Zone (IMPZ) is about Dh50,000 per annum (payable across four cheques). In Discovery Gardens, the rents are Dh60,000 per annum (eight cheques),while rents in International City are at Dh50,000 per annum (payable across four cheques).

A two-bedroom apartment in IMPZ is currently rented for Dh70,000 per annum in four cheques. In Discovery Gardens, current rental are Dh80,000 per annum in four cheques while in International City, current annual rents is Dh75,000 in four cheques.

According to Asteco, a studio in Discovery Gardens and International City is being rented for Dh40,000 and Dh38,000. A one-bedroom apartment in Discovery Gardens, International City and IMPZ are Dh60,000, Dh55,000 and Dh45,000 respectively. A two-bedroom apartment is being rented for Dh85,000 per annum, Dh70,000 per annum and Dh60,000 per annum, respectively, in the same areas.

According to Colliers International, a two-bedroom apartment in IMPZ is being rented for Dh68,000 and Dh70,000 in International City. In Discovery Gardens, rents for a two-bedroom apartment is about Dh75,000 per annum.

When asked if rents were higher in freehold areas compared to non-freehold areas, Camilla Van Der Merwe, Head of Leasing, Dubai, Asteco Property Management, said: "There is not much of a difference between rental rates on freehold and non-freehold properties. Location, access, facilities, good property management and proximity to amenities determine how successful rental rates are for a particular area."

She said owners who have purchased for investment and leased their property are looking to retain their tenants by negotiating and reducing rents as per the current market rates.

"It is difficult to assess which areas are better and it really depends on individual preferences. Some people prefer to remain in the old areas because they have been living there for a long time and they are paying low rentals.

"All depends on which areas people work. Somebody working in Bur Dubai or Deira may not consider Discovery Gardens to live since it is farther out and commuting to and from work would be an issue even though rents are low there," said Der Merwe.

Kosta Giannopoulos, Manager, Residential Sales and Leasing, Better Homes, said in terms of rentals, one can find similar priced apartments in both freehold and non-freehold areas, but people choose to live in different areas due to personal preferences such as proximity to work and cultural reasons. "The non-freehold areas tend to have a more interest for bachelor and shared accommodation. Freehold areas tend to be leased by newer arrivals to Dubai," said Giannopoulos.

"It cannot be said that one area has higher rents than another except that International City offers the lowest rent of any freehold area. Areas such as Barsha and Nahda also offer one of the lowest rents for non-freehold," he said.
 
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stumbled

New Member
Telegraph: Prices of New build properties have fallen 50% not 9% in the UK

source:
Price of new build properties have fallen 50pc not 9pc - Telegraph

So same as Dubai heh?
:tee:
Like I said in my post, lets not try and divert from the topic, this forum isn't about UK or USA.By pointing UK, IT DOESN'T MAKE DUBAI any better.Further, you're contradicting yourself, you earlier were hoping if things get better in the west it will help Dubai, have you changed your views??
Yes Uk is bad and USA is even worse, but the gov. here are doing something about it, whats is being done in Dubai??

Your post on international city is flawed. We all know the UAE govt controls the media and everything is said to help the economy and that is a cheap way to rescue something that is sinking. Just read the level of unsatisfaction with the people living in those pigeon holes.
 
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paul66

New Member
UAE Property prices rise again

UAE Property prices rise again

from The National : 14th July 2009
source: http://www.thenational.ae/article/20090714/BUSINESS/707149932/1041

Property prices in parts of Abu Dhabi and Dubai are registering big increases as buyers regain their confidence, brokers said Tuesday.

In Dubai, they listed areas where prices had increased by up to 12 per cent last month, while in Abu Dhabi properties on Al Reem Island were seeing increases about 30 per cent in the past couple of months.

After a lull of about eight months in which average prices fell by up to 30 per cent in the capital and 40 per cent in Dubai, buyers have returned. This is the third consecutive month of price rises, according to brokers, but many bankers and analysts are still cautious about saying the market has levelled out, with some predicting further declines.

According to Gregory Antioch, a senior sales negotiator at the Dubai property broker Smith and Ken, a three-bedroom villa in The Springs, an established residential community developed by Emaar Properties, that was selling for between Dh1 million (US$272,000) and Dh1.5m in May now has a price tag of Dh2m.

Mr Antioch said a two-bedroom villa was now priced at Dh1.4m, compared with Dh1m in May.

He said prices of homes in The Meadows and The Greens, also projects by Emaar, were up by 7 per cent and 5 per cent respectively.

“People are less hesitant and are prepared to spend a bit of money,” Mr Antioch said. “It’s mostly end-users realising it’s cheaper to buy than rent. Distressed sales have pretty much gone.”

Buyers started to trickle back into the market in April, when the first signs of price stabilisation emerged. A report by HSBC bank at the end of May said agreed selling prices in the UAE rose 5 per cent in May compared with April, on top of April’s 4 per cent gain on March.

Last month, Deutsche Bank reported an average price increase of about 6.5 per cent to Dh1,285 per square foot in 13 major locations in Dubai last month, compared with May.

Brokers say the trend has remained steady with villa prices in some areas of Dubai, such as The Springs, rising between 10 per cent and 12 per cent since May.

On the Palm Jumeirah, a reclaimed island development by Nakheel where prices fell by as much as 40 per cent between September and November last year, brokers claim prices have risen by up to 20 per cent since a “low point” in March.

According to Richard Pemberton, a broker at Edwards and Towers, May and last month were the company’s busiest months since about September and October last year.

Mr Pemberton said a four-bedroom Garden Villa on the Palm is now valued at between Dh7.5m and Dh8m, compared with Dh6.5m in March, while a basic apartment in the Shoreline Apartments is now valued at Dh1.9m compared with Dh1.7m.

“Once it got to a point where prices had stabilised and didn’t fall for two weeks – effectively ‘the bottom’ – things picked up,” he said.

“Buyers on the sidelines were waiting for this to happen. Villas that were worth Dh6m or Dh6.5m got snapped up.”

Mr Pemberton added that most sales were now being driven by end-users – those who buy properties to live in them – rather than speculators.

“A lot of people who couldn’t afford to rent or live on the Palm Jumeirah a year or two ago are now interested in living there.”

In Abu Dhabi, brokers said there was an increase in prices and sales last month, compared with April and May.

According to Mukambar Djurajeva, a property consultant for Engel and Volkers, prices started to pick up after the Cityscape Abu Dhabi property exhibition in April.

“There was a time when the market was dead, from January to March, with owners putting down their prices during the crisis,” Ms Djurajeva said.

“But [after Cityscape] they thought ‘wow, I can sell now’, and immediately put their prices up. It was very crazy.”

For example, prices for a near-completed property in Tala Tower, at Marina Square on Al Reem Island, went up from a low of Dh950 per sq ft in April to Dh1,250 today, Ms Djurajeva said, representing an increase of about 30 per cent. “Now there is nothing less than Dh1,250.”

Prices of property elsewhere on Al Reem Island are about Dh1,100 per sq ft.

“But the only thing we are seeing selling on Al Reem Island at the moment is anything around Marina Square, which is about to be finished by the end of this year or beginning of next year,” said Susan Cronin, from Aljar Properties.

The most expensive project in Abu Dhabi is Al Bandar residences at Al Raha Beach, where properties are selling for about Dh1,400 per sq ft.

Properties on the rest of Al Raha Beach are being offered for between Dh1,100 and Dh1,200 per sq ft, brokers say.

“Al Raha Beach is a more demandable area right now compared to Al Reem Island,” said Ammar Asaad, the head of sales at Hamptons for Abu Dhabi.

“There is also a question of confidence. Al Raha Beach is being developed by one developer, which is Aldar, whereas Al Reem has many developers.”

:thrasher:
 
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