Wills in Egypt

[majicou]

Can anyone - perhaps Zehiad - post up to date accurate information regarding wills - as information I have is conflicting...

1. Do you need a will in each country (I am refering to the UK & Egypt) or not (this is because a will normally states) "this is the last will and testament" - if you have a will in each country how can this apply to both?

2. If you need a will for each country - how do you get round the property etc. in the other country (do you, for example, in the UK will state - this excludes any assets in Egypt?)

3. If you are a British Citizen would the Egyptian assets be dealt with under UK law or Egyptian law?

Any other information would be useful

Many thanks

 

[Zeiad Yehia]

Can anyone - perhaps Zehiad - post up to date accurate information regarding wills - as information I have is conflicting...

1. Do you need a will in each country (I am refering to the UK & Egypt) or not (this is because a will normally states) "this is the last will and testament" - if you have a will in each country how can this apply to both?

2. If you need a will for each country - how do you get round the property etc. in the other country (do you, for example, in the UK will state - this excludes any assets in Egypt?)

3. If you are a British Citizen would the Egyptian assets be dealt with under UK law or Egyptian law?

Any other information would be useful

Many thanks

Dear Sir / Madam,

Thanks for the question.

Please be informed that wills in Egypt adhere to entirely different set of rules than those in the U.K. For instance, a natural heir i.e. son, daughter...etc. CANNOT be a beneficiary in Egyptian wills, as wills must be granted to a non-heir as an essential condition. Moreover the will, according to Civil Law, cannot be inclusive of more than 1 / 3 of the entire asset.

This difference is easy to fix with the usufruct system i.e. in Sharm el Sheikh, whilst with the freehold system general family law will apply to the purchaser who will be treated just like an Egyptian purchaser. Sons will inherit double the daughters, and portions will be distributed according to the very complicated distributed system of Egyptian law.

An alternative method utilized widely to avoid inheritance rules in freehold system is to issue a sale contract to the desired beneficiary (ies) in two copies, keep a copy safe with yourself and another with your lawyer, only to appear after the ancestor's death.

All the best,

Zeiad Yehia
Barrister

 

[wemyss1960]

Welcome back to the forum Zeiad.

 

[Zeiad Yehia]

Welcome back to the forum Zeiad.

Thanks a lot.

Zeiad

 

[Alan Cockayne]

Legal clarity

Dear Sir / Madam,

Thanks for the question.

Please be informed that wills in Egypt adhere to entirely different set of rules than those in the U.K. For instance, a natural heir i.e. son, daughter...etc. CANNOT be a beneficiary in Egyptian wills, as wills must be granted to a non-heir as an essential condition. Moreover the will, according to Civil Law, cannot be inclusive of more than 1 / 3 of the entire asset.
This difference is easy to fix with the usufruct system i.e. in Sharm el Sheikh, whilst with the freehold system general family law will apply to the purchaser who will be treated just like an Egyptian purchaser. Sons will inherit double the daughters, and portions will be distributed according to the very complicated distributed system of Egyptian law.

An alternative method utilized widely to avoid inheritance rules in freehold system is to issue a sale contract to the desired beneficiary (ies) in two copies, keep a copy safe with yourself and another with your lawyer, only to appear after the ancestor's death.

All the best,

Zeiad Yehia
Barrister

After a long absence Zeiad, I'm sure the forum members will be eager for clarifications. Such as with the bold type above.

Sincere Question: do you think these rules and regulations will ever be reformed under a new Goverment administration?

Only the ambiguities that come with such statements are a deterent for investors rather than an inducement to buy.

Regards.

Alan.

 

[Zeiad Yehia]

After a long absence Zeiad, I'm sure the forum members will be eager for clarifications. Such as with the bold type above.

Sincere Question: do you think these rules and regulations will ever be reformed under a new Goverment administration?

Only the ambiguities that come with such statements are a deterent for investors rather than an inducement to buy.

Regards.

Alan.

Hi Alan,

Thanks a lot. I hope you're in best condition.

I don't think these rules will change, because unfortunately they belong to Family Law, which is the sole branch of Egyptian Laws based on Islamic law, which I completely believe shall be separated from modern-life laws, but I know that you know how things go in Egypt. Just don't expect Islamic laws to be changed.

They should not deter anyone to be honest, because there are ways to avoid them, and not on all cases either, because they may serve the purpose in some cases i.e. someone who has a son but not a daughter, but to be honest I find it entirely unfair to discriminate between kids based on gender. Hence I do not agree in the slightest with these rules, but they are, however, the rules!

However, please utilize this information to warn against misleading information some foreign investors get about having a will in Egypt. I know you're active on many forums and can spread the word. Civil Law has defined the will in details, and it doesn't work as people desire.

All the best,

Zeiad Yehia
Barrister

 

[Alan Cockayne]

Hi Zeiad.

I hope you are recovered and thank you for responding.

I'm sure you won't mind me stating and just to make readers understand, REPEAT BUSINESS means to return and remain loyal to a provider of services and advice.... for further purchases.
Unlike yourself, some lawyers who fail to instruct their clients properly, expect customers to come back to finish what should have been done properly in the first place.

In other words "to be paid twice for the same work" which is typical of Egyptian mindset in many professions and trades..

Do you have any comments on the fact that wills never seem to be offered at the same time by some legal personel when doing the preliminary purchase agreement? Don't you think there should be standard practices amongst your association of legal representatives?

Unfortunately, many investors obtain our good advice after joining these forums, which often means expensive repeat journeys.

Kind regards.

Alan.

 

[majicou]

Many thanks for your reply Zeiad.

 

[Zeiad Yehia]

Hi Zeiad.

I hope you are recovered and thank you for responding.

I'm sure you won't mind me stating and just to make readers understand, REPEAT BUSINESS means to return and remain loyal to a provider of services and advice.... for further purchases.
Unlike yourself, some lawyers who fail to instruct their clients properly, expect customers to come back to finish what should have been done properly in the first place.

In other words "to be paid twice for the same work" which is typical of Egyptian mindset in many professions and trades..

Do you have any comments on the fact that wills never seem to be offered at the same time by some legal personel when doing the preliminary purchase agreement? Don't you think there should be standard practices amongst your association of legal representatives?

Unfortunately, many investors obtain our good advice after joining these forums, which often means expensive repeat journeys.

Kind regards.

Alan.

Hi Alan,

This is so right on usufruct basis, whilst on freehold basis it cannot, for the aforementioned reasons, and subsequently if someone, a lawyer or another, asked someone later for additional fees to write a 'will' this would be simply unneeded money for fake work, to put it in the most polite form.

I believe that these forums might save people not only unneeded expensive visits, but can actually protect their very right in some cases, when they get the proper information which would prevent them from going through procedures meant only to get their money but offering actually nothing for them.

All the best,

Zeiad Yehia
Barrister

 

[Zeiad Yehia]

Many thanks for your reply Zeiad.

You are truly welcome.

All the best,

Zeiad Yehia
Barrister

 

[Alan Cockayne]

Thanks Zeiad. That makes sense.

However, how do you regulate the bad lawyers in Egypt?
We have a system set up for that in Europe as you know. I'm sure readers will be interested in that answer.

Alan.

 

[Alan Cockayne]

Hmmmm..

There IS justice then?

 

[Zeiad Yehia]

Hmmmm..

There IS justice then?

The lawyer and the person in me, both, tell you yes there is! Absolutely!!!

Zeiad

 

[shilly]

Dear Sir / Madam,

Thanks for the question.

Please be informed that wills in Egypt adhere to entirely different set of rules than those in the U.K. For instance, a natural heir i.e. son, daughter...etc. CANNOT be a beneficiary in Egyptian wills, as wills must be granted to a non-heir as an essential condition. Moreover the will, according to Civil Law, cannot be inclusive of more than 1 / 3 of the entire asset.

This difference is easy to fix with the usufruct system i.e. in Sharm el Sheikh, whilst with the freehold system general family law will apply to the purchaser who will be treated just like an Egyptian purchaser. Sons will inherit double the daughters, and portions will be distributed according to the very complicated distributed system of Egyptian law.

An alternative method utilized widely to avoid inheritance rules in freehold system is to issue a sale contract to the desired beneficiary (ies) in two copies, keep a copy safe with yourself and another with your lawyer, only to appear after the ancestor's death.

All the best,

Zeiad Yehia
Barrister

Hi,
I have read your replies regarding wills and would like to know would it make any difference that on my flat there is my husband two children and I named on the deeds.If either one of us dies would it make any difference to the estate or to the other remaining names on the property?

 

[Zeiad Yehia]

Hi,
I have read your replies regarding wills and would like to know would it make any difference that on my flat there is my husband two children and I named on the deeds.If either one of us dies would it make any difference to the estate or to the other remaining names on the property?

Thanks for the question.

Firstly I'd like to draw your kind attention to the fact that people under 21 years of age, are prohibited by law to be involved in any kind of legal transactions which imply exchanging benefits i.e. sale.

You said in your post that your 'children' are written in the contract, and in the event these children are less than 21 years of age, then the contract is null and void RELATIVELY on their part only, whilst it is valid against you and your husband.

Presuming they're 21 years of age or above. You currently own the property altogether on 'common ownership' basis, subsequently it'd be for the court after death of one of the owner to determine its portion of ownership in proportion to the entire asset, and then distribute it on the legitimate next of kin as explained in the previous post.

Once one of the owners deceases the others shall claim an 'inheritance announcement' from court, and it is for the court's committee delegated for that matter to determine the portion of the deceased person.

Your children's age would make difference with a lot of things here, big difference in fact, and hereby I mean their age AT THE VERY DATE of purchase rather than as of now.

All the best,

Zeiad Yehia
Barrister

 

[shilly]

Thanks for the question.

Firstly I'd like to draw your kind attention to the fact that people under 21 years of age, are prohibited by law to be involved in any kind of legal transactions which imply exchanging benefits i.e. sale.

You said in your post that your 'children' are written in the contract, and in the event these children are less than 21 years of age, then the contract is null and void RELATIVELY on their part only, whilst it is valid against you and your husband.

Presuming they're 21 years of age or above. You currently own the property altogether on 'common ownership' basis, subsequently it'd be for the court after death of one of the owner to determine its portion of ownership in proportion to the entire asset, and then distribute it on the legitimate next of kin as explained in the previous post.

Once one of the owners deceases the others shall claim an 'inheritance announcement' from court, and it is for the court's committee delegated for that matter to determine the portion of the deceased person.

Your children's age would make difference with a lot of things here, big difference in fact, and hereby I mean their age AT THE VERY DATE of purchase rather than as of now.

All the best,

Zeiad Yehia
Barrister

Hi Zeiad,

Thanks for that my children were 22 and 25 when they were put on the deeds.We were told that no one under 21 years of age could go on the deeds

 

[Zeiad Yehia]

Hi Zeiad,

Thanks for that my children were 22 and 25 when they were put on the deeds.We were told that no one under 21 years of age could go on the deeds

You are welcome.

I can tell you now comfortably that you're having no serious problems as your children are not exactly 'children' in the eyes of law, at all.


Heirs of every deceased person in that case will inherit normally according to the previously explained method, with no trouble, and it is all legal.

In the event you wanted to assign it directly to your children, sign a freehold portion's sale contract directly to them, get a signature validation on it in order to prove the date of issuing the said contract officially, and then keep it safe in your bank or with your lawyer only to appear if need be. In the event you have no other heirs whatsoever (which is very unlikely to be the scenario) then you don't need to do anything at all.

All the best,

Zeiad Yehia
Barrister

 

[shilly]

You are welcome.

I can tell you now comfortably that you're having no serious problems as your children are not exactly 'children' in the eyes of law, at all.


Heirs of every deceased person in that case will inherit normally according to the previously explained method, with no trouble, and it is all legal.

In the event you wanted to assign it directly to your children, sign a freehold portion's sale contract directly to them, get a signature validation on it in order to prove the date of issuing the said contract officially, and then keep it safe in your bank or with your lawyer only to appear if need be. In the event you have no other heirs whatsoever (which is very unlikely to be the scenario) then you don't need to do anything at all.

All the best,

Zeiad Yehia
Barrister

Thanks Zeiad I will pass this info over to the owner concerned as they do not know how to use a computer !!!

 

[Zeiad Yehia]

Thanks Zeiad I will pass this info over to the owner concerned as they do not know how to use a computer !!!

You're really welcome.


All the best,

Zeiad Yehia
Barrister